Severity Navel Gazes... about diverse stimulation and her thetwocents.com R&Rs

[severity_softly]

HEE. Apparently, I'm nuts. *G* (Also, I apparently don't like The Instincts or Memoriam or the entirety of season 4, in spite of having not said that.) First, let me say that if this happens to be someone on my flist (if they came from LJ, it has to be that, or someone who dropped by my journal randomly), I am not offended. When I said "That's the beauty of fandom . We can completely disagree with each other, and BOTH still be right in whatever we believe," I meant it entirely. I like discussing things like this (even if, in this case, I don't think there's much actual discussion coming from the other side of this conversation). I don't WANT everyone to agree with me. What the fuck fun would that be? Not only that, I know my own opinions are sometimes dissenting opinions. If I have problems with an episode, I even go so far as to poke fun at the entire thing. Because, well, I do this for FUN, people. :) (Not that I wouldn't love to get paid to write or to spew my opinions about something I love, but that's another story.)

I have people with varying opinions on character/ships on my flist. I have people on my flist that I enjoy talking to and like very much whose ships/favorite characters I simply cannot, or will not, even read. I have people on my flist who seem to literally not be able to stand each other over differing opinions on characters/ships/fandom things, which I find sort of odd (so long as opinions are not hurting anyone or incorporated into something that is supposed to be accessible to the entire fandom, why does it matter?) I find the diversity of opinion stimulating. If you don't like x-character/ship that I do (or like one I don't), tell me why! I might debate the point with you, if I'm so inclined, even if I know full well I may not change your opinion, and you're welcome to debate it right back. So long as everyone stays civil and respectful, it's exactly the sort of thing I like.

As Isaac in Sports Night once said (and he may have been quoting someone; I don't know), "A stupid man surrounds himself with smart people. A smart man surrounds himself with smart people who disagree with him." (Man, I wish more politicians would listen to that. Heh.) If everyone tells me I'm awesome (which I love, btw... just saying ^_~), I become insulated in my little cocoon of awesomesauce, and I never grow (of course, it helps me that no matter what you say, I am never satisfied). If you disagree with me and make a good point, I don't mind saying that, or even outright admitting if I'm wrong. If you make a good point and don't change my mind right at that moment, you've at least given me something to think about, and who knows, maybe I might change my mind later.

Whoa, I've gone way off topic. I honestly don't think the comments I linked were worthy of this level of introspection, but I think it spurred something in my head that I've been wanting to say for a few days (maybe longer) now, in a much nicer way that my original intent to say them would have come out. So you get it all in one big chunk of random, and everyone wins. :)

Back to the point: What I think is funny is that I got this comment (and the one above from the same person, who is obviously not reading my words very carefully) on a R&R in which I adored the episode. The ones where I have been, in innerslytherin's words when she proofread for me, "a bit harsh," have either gotten no reply, or mostly replies in agreement. O.o

Recently, the year end stats for the site got emailed out to everyone, and apparently, I had the story with the most comments on it for the entire year. I was very excited and pleased by this, but I'm not saying that to brag. I'm saying that because I'm trying to figure out why. I've had at least one person outright tell me I didn't understand Rossi's character if I believed a certain thing about a given episode (for all intents and purposes, but I think it was a simple case of misunderstanding, as I didn't want to give away the ending) on one review, and I took it with a grain of salt and moved on. Now I have this comment. BOTH disagreeing comments have come on reviews in which I loved the episode. Again, odd. Seriously, do people like it better when I snark about things? *G*

Anyway, I got off subject again. What I'm wondering (what I think will help me grow as a writer, even, to know) is: what it is that compels people to comment to my reviews? I've gotten top comments one month (and because of that month, for the overall year), but I've been a contender most months that I've written for TTC. So, why? Because I'm honest and don't gush about everything? Because I try to have a sense of humor about it? Because I'm snarky and opinionated and I don't care if you disagree with me? *coooouuuugh* These are all actually things I worry about when I write my reviews. I keep thinking one day KP (the head writer) is going to email me and go "you can't say THAT!" To his credit, he never has, but I worry sometimes about where the line is. And now I wonder if I get more comments simply because I toe the line. Or am I completely wrong? I could be; I often read people write about themselves and think, "man, wtf? Is s/he looking at the same person I am?" (And the answer is no. No one sees themselves objectively, and no one sees other people objectively.) Do I not actually push enough/at all? Am I getting comments for a completely different reason? I'd like to think my reviews are at least intelligent, but I don't think I'm unusually insightful. I don't look at things like how CM fits into the grand scheme of the world, and though there have been exceptions, I generally don't think about things like social implications of the choices the show makes (though, in all fairness, I think that's partly because they show is usually doesn't make blunders about those things), etc. etc. I don't think about themes throughout the season, or what I think it means that Reid is wearing a tie pin now. I mostly let other people think about those things, and I nod and listen, and say, "good point" and "aren't you smart! I wish I'd thought of that", but it's not part of my natural view of the world, and therefore the show.

God, I'm rambling. Worse, I'm rambling self-indulgently about my own writing. *sigh* I would like opinions, if you have any, though, and while I would always prefer to have a "face to face" conversation with someone, anon comments are always turned on in this journal.

Comments

[mcgarrygirl78.livejournal.com]

I like people to disagree with me as well. I definitely never want combative people on my f-list, I want to surround myself with relative peace and harmony, but healthy debate for me is the equivalent of an erection.....was that TMI?

I dont always get it, people show me love and stuff and say they love what I write and believe me, that is s damn good feeling but lets discuss. I dont know, I think a lot of people aren't discussers (if that's even a word), they just say I hate it or I love it, or It was OK and walk off into the sunset. Asking anything more might be asking too much. I think I am just adding more ramble to your ramble and hope I dont come off like an elitist snob, which some people tell me I can be when I am just making conversation.

It has just been my experience that people like/dislike things and often dont have an exactly viable argument as to why and so it is hard to get into a worhtwhile discussion about it because you might want to bash your head into a wall. Lately though, I have had some awesome debates with people, mostly about fandom and I walked away feeling awesome, just having talked about things, made me turn my head and look at something I have seen before another way, whether I ended up agreeing or not. Hell, just because of you and innerslytherin, I am reading and enjoying slash in this fandom....something I would have turned my nose up to a few months ago and probably said "That's disgusting". So, I learned something : )

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

I definitely never want combative people on my f-list

I have a few people who seem to outright hate each other for reasons I don't fully get, but so long as they keep the fighting out of MY journal, I can live with that to an extent. :P

I think I am just adding more ramble to your ramble

LOL Yeah, I think you are, but I don't mind in the least. I think at least in this fandom, the people who bother to post reaction posts in their journals actually DO want to talk, and that's awesome. I sometimes hesitate to comment with "I disagree" because sometimes over the internet it's hard to tell inflection, but I usually do anyway, and then hope that I don't constantly come across as an argumentative bitch. *shrugs* And after a while, you learn who's receptive to comments like that and who isn't.

hope I dont come off like an elitist snob, which some people tell me I can be when I am just making conversation

I don't think you do (or haven't so far, anyway), but then I get that IRL, actually, which is SO far from the truth it's funny. I'm shy and keep to myself, and mostly for that reason I've heard SO MANY TIMES, "I thought you were a total snob until I got to know you." Of course, some people get to know me sometimes and still don't really get that I'm not, because I sometimes use big words. ;) (Okay, that maybe WAS a little snobby just then, but I recently got the shit teased out of me at work for using a word no one else understood, and was like "am I in grade school again? My God." So I might still be a little sensitive atm.)

something I would have turned my nose up to a few months ago and probably said "That's disgusting".

LOL Really? That's AWESOME! Though, if you would have told me I/we would have been writing het (with smut, at that!) a year ago, I would have laughed my ass off, so I guess I can see that.

[mcgarrygirl78.livejournal.com]

Everything you just said, I reply yes. Especially the getting teased/tortured at work for using "big words" and people getting to know me and saying "Man, I thought you were a snob before I knew you". Hmm, interesting.

Point is, discussion good, debate better, and I love it when I can really have a good one with someone and we can both walk away with something. It's what fandom and LJ are all about for me. That, and rambly posts about my cat : )

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

ZOMG THE OTHER DAY, MY CAT DID THE CUTEST THING... >.>

Pets posts and dream posts = <3 ...I should post PIKSHURES! ;)

See what you've started! *g*

[albydarned.livejournal.com]

One thing that I've run into ridiculously often in fandom (and, to be honest, I see it a lot more in SPN than CM, but I attribute that to it being a larger fandom), is that at least half of the people who are fans on the show and go online to continue to be fans of the show develop such a blind spot for the show that it suddenly cannot do any wrong. Luckily, LJ tends to house the bulk of the "sane" fans, but if you go to any of the message boards or major forums, watch out!

Personally, I don't see why she felt the need to comment to your review like that. It didn't read as anything offensive to me, and as you've said, people are entitled to their own opinions. If she didn't agree with you, then sure, she could comment, or better yet, she could get a blog of her own and post about her own opinion. But arguing for the sake of arguing, and more, going and calling you "nuts" just because you don't share similar opinions with her (and like you said, obviously she wasn't reading all that well if she came to those conclusions) is really pathetic on her part.

That's the twinned beauty and disaster of the online fandom. If you took a poll of every single person who watches CM, this season wouldn't probably be considered the fan favorite (typically, earlier seasons of any show are preferred over later ones). But unfortunately, online fans have that blind spot that I mentioned earlier, and a majority of them (including the crazies) would be like OMG BEST SEASON EVAR!

I don't really understand the dynamics of commenting because I only comment around LJ, and even then, 99% of the time it's on my friend's journals, not communities. The only times I feel the need to comment are when the poster made OUTRAGEOUS statements that need refuting, but even still I tend to avoid those because I hate wank. Either way, you've made a lot of really good points here, and I don't think that you were self-indulgent or overly rambly.

I especially loved the part where Reid took his shirt off and started table dancing for the entire unit because someone forgot to tell him that the punch was spiked. Oh, wait, what? I'm sorry? What were you saying about people reading things and then coming to conclusions that weren't there? ;)

[elekanahmen.livejournal.com]

I sometimes use big words.

I find your discourse to be quite vivacious and verbose while still maintaining an air of sophistication and distinction. Anyone who dares call you a "snob" is clearly an imbecilic cretin who doesn't deserve even the most meager of your time

(IDK I WANTID TO YOOS MY THUHSAWRIS)

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

OH EM GEE, I LURVE JOOOS!

Damn Ravenclaws...

[elekanahmen.livejournal.com]

I LURVE JOOS 2!!!!

a ravenclaw and a slytherin combined could rule the world, ijs...

[elekanahmen.livejournal.com]

and now for my intelligent comment

Personally, and this isn't me being a tinhat, I do personally feel that this season is one of the stronger ones in my opinion. I don't think it's perfect, there are some episodes I could have done without and some that could have done better... and I think there are still some elements missing from it that have been present in the past that could make it just stellar.. but I do think that as a series, it's only gotten stronger through age and certain cast dynamics.

Do I think every aspect of every episode is perfect? No. And that's one of the things that I support about you spinning off onto your own CM blog. You're not all happy rays of sunshine about the show, you're critical (as a critic should be) but you still love it despite its flaws (which it does have, every show does) and you're not just there to kiss ass and make friends with the creative team and cast, you're there to legitimately talk about the show, the good, the bad, the ugly, and the sexeriffic.

[nebula99.livejournal.com]

Adam Ant! *squee*

(sorry, please excuse the interruption)

[nebula99.livejournal.com]

On CM - I agree with you on Season 4. There are a few episodes I've been less than impressed with - Mayhem, Masterpiece, Paradise, Brothers in Arms. Then there have been episodes that I've really liked - Minimal Loss, Catching Out, Normal and Bloodline.

Then there was The instincts/Memoriam - the character stuff in those episodes was very well written and performed. However, the plot in The Instincts was fairly shaky. I can't complain about digging into Reid's past and his trauma though - he is in some ways the character that centres the whole show with the other characters almost being defined in their relationship to him. Plus we all knew he had Daddy issues.

But I can appreciate why others might not have enjoyed them so much.

As for disagreements, debates - I like them. I'm happy for people to comment and say "I don't agree with you - and this is why." I like a good discussion and I like unpicking and delving into themes and subtext and looking at nitpicky details. This is why I like the CM fandom - it's an intelligent show with (mostly *g*) intelligent fans and the episodes merit discussion and rewatching. Having said that, I think people should remember their manners when making comments - there is never any need to be rude.

Glad you are doing well with your reviews - I enjoy reading them.

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

(*cough* It's fine. I squee every time I see that icon of yours too. *g*)

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

Oh yes, when someone says every single ep is good, that blind spot is visible from a mile away. I might not have given such a thorough response, if it weren't for that I can't stand when someone puts words in my mouth. :/

typically, earlier seasons of any show are preferred over later ones

If Rossi had been in the first two season, I probably would have liked them the best. As it stands, I so prefer Rossi episodes now, I'd go with season three. :)

I didn't really have a problem with the comment itself, though I certainly wish it would have been more... insightful? If not insightful, at least more accurate, in regards to what I actually said. I very rarely comment on discussion threads and the like, and do tend to comment within my circle of friends, too.

the part where Reid took his shirt off and started table dancing for the entire unit because someone forgot to tell him that the punch was spiked

*beats away bunnehs of dooooom*

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

I think cast dynamics are stronger, as you said. I will agree with that. I think Prentiss and Rossi add SO MUCH to the show (even when I sometimes don't like Emily. >.>). But the actual stories in the episodes I think have gotten less consistent.

And the last part? Word. If people want to read "ZOMG EVERYONE INVOLVED IN CM SHITS GOLD!" they can go to CMFB. >.> I mean, that blog is good at what it does, and I will give it that, but it's not exactly a very real fan experience, imho.

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

*G* I really quite liked Masterpiece, but I can certainly understand where people are coming from. Conversely, Minimal Loss is one I refuse to rewatch. I just... can't. Maybe, like, next year I will. LOL

he is in some ways the character that centres the whole show with the other characters almost being defined in their relationship to him

That's an interesting thought, and I can't say that I agree or disagree. I'll have to give it a bit more thought. Thing is, whether that's true or not, I can't see any way (yet--and if you can point one out, please do) in which his relationships with the other team members have been informed by the events of those episodes, so the trauma still feels like just extra trauma thrown on the pile.

I do have to admit, though, that my objective fandom opinions, and my subjective fandom opinions (the part of me that writes fanfics, etc), do tend to see things differently. I don't mind Extra Reid Angst in fic. When the "zomg let's torture Spencer moar' becomes canon, though, that's where I get more critical of the amount of pain they give him.

I also have to admit that Diana has a very special place in my heart, so part of why Memoriam is so hard for me is watching what happened to her. SHE, imho, is the REAL victim of this story, in the grand shceme of things. Of course, that is my emotional response and not my critical one.

Having said that, I think people should remember their manners when making comments - there is never any need to be rude.

I'm trying to think of it as misinformed and reactionary, rather than rude, and I'm really not bothered. I just thought it was sort of... silly. LOL The negative comment before was a bit more of an attack on my opinion (or a more well thought out one, at least), but I replied, and never heard back, so I'm just going to assume that they either understood what I meant and didn't bother to reply, or decided my ability to reason and debate was too grand to try to do battle with and ran away. ;) *snickers*

[elekanahmen.livejournal.com]

I think one of the things that CM is missing from the first couple of seasons is the magic.

Not... physics magic *points at icon* but... the oh my god how did you know that, are you psychic? magic.

Like... I was watching No Way Out and even thought I knew what was going to happen, almost word for word, I was still sparkle, sparkle surprised when Gideon knew about the notebook and exactly where it would be. I miss how they'd melt into the unsubs routine and walk along side them as they do their day to day, like in scared to death when they moved the guys notebook and he walked back and straightened it... things like that, there hasn't been that sparkle, sparkle surprise this season and I kinda miss it. They just lay it out. Yano? That's a big thing that I didn't even realize I was missing until I just recently started re-re-re-reviewing old episodes.

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

YES! I loved that so much. I HAD noticed they weren't doing it much at all anymore, and that's one of the things that made me LOVELOVELOVE the interview with Cate and Prentiss in Bloodline. The camera work and the way she was intergrated into the crime as it happen. BEAUTIFUL.

[ubervirgin.livejournal.com]

One of the reasons I don't venture very often from the fanfic sites is the rabid fanbase a great deal of the more popular fandoms develop. I like being able to debate a certain point and have an exchange of ideas. In most rabid fandoms you get lynched if you mention an opinion that differs.

A few years ago, an anime, Gundam Wing, was pretty popular. The fanbase was divided into two camps. One camp shipped Relena/Heero and the other camp hated Relena and wanted her to die. Very few people on either side were able to explain their thoughts without inciting a wank.

I like the CM fandom in particular because I don't seem to run across to many people that are rabid about certain pairings. Reid, is luckily, the little black dress of the fandom and looks good in almost every pairing. If someone really dislikes the pairing, most of the time, they are smart enough NOT to read the story. I am not all that big a fan of het, so unless I think the pairing is adorkable or I like the author, I don't really read it. I go in waves of preferring Reid with certain teammates. I don't really have an OTP for the fandom.

I think that the people responding to posts should imagine that they are in a coffee shop with the person they are responding to. If they wouldn't say what they are typing to the person over a frappacino at Starbucks, then maybe, just maybe, they should think about what they are typing and either reword it or not say it at all.

And now I sound like Andy Rooney.

[nebula99.livejournal.com]

*G* I really quite liked Masterpiece, but I can certainly understand where people are coming from. Conversely, Minimal Loss is one I refuse to rewatch. I just... can't. Maybe, like, next year I will. LOL

With Masterpiece, I just couldn't take Colonel Sanders The Unsub seriously.

I can see your point about Memoriam and the ReidAngst but I liked the way they played on Reid's screwed up biological family to emphasise the far more supportive family he has with his colleagues. I just wish they hadn't gone with the "Is my Dad a murdering pedo?". Bringing Reid and his father together under more likely circumstances would have made more sense.



But all the Diana scenes and Reid's pouting and bitchy remarks to his Deadbeat Dad were, for me, made of win. And yes, Diana was sacrificed but interestingly, she isn't angry (or not out loud anyway). Reid, however, is still fuming.

[severity-softly.livejournal.com]

LOL No, I can really understand that, and I can agree that it was a bit "mwhahaha, i is eeeeveeeel!" *shrugs* I just saw the character a little differently once he started talking about the extra chromosomes, etc.

Bringing Reid and his father together under more likely circumstances would have made more sense.

EXACTLY. Not that I had any desire to see William Reid again, but you know. At least he did get to be a bitch to him, you're right, so that did make it a bit better. *G*

but interestingly, she isn't angry (or not out loud anyway)

Well, not only has a lot of time and therapy passed since then, but she blocked it all from her memory (or the meds did; it's like chicken and egg there, I think), so I can imagine it still seems separate from herself after this long. On top of that, Spencer was clearly upset, and she reads him wonderfully, so she may have been putting on the 'strong face' for him. Then again, she really just might not be upset anymore--she didn't seem to be angry with William anymore or not want to be around him like Spencer did.

Or maybe it's a combo of all those things. (Oh, look, I just talked myself in circles!) It's an interesting thing to speculate on.